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Ken:

James Carrion, he is the one that you said didn't make it, right?

Dennis Balthaser:

Right. He is the head of MUFON and he called and said he was sick and couldn't make it and we got Mike Forstein in his place. He showed a video that is going to be out, I think this month or next month, on the Internet, I think. It has some fantastic backing in it. It's got Edgar Mitchell, the astronaut. It has the 911 operator that took some of the calls on the Phoenix Lights in 97.

Ken:

Oh I would be interested in seeing that.

Dennis Balthaser:

My hang up with the Phoenix Lights is that they claim it was the Maryland Air National Guard....

Ken:

Right, with the flares.

Dennis Balthaser:

Yes with the flares. That is simple enough to verify. Bring them back and do it again and notify the people in Phoenix, so that they can video tape it and compare it.

Ken:

Yeah, that will never happen.

Dennis Balthaser:

No it won't happen, but that would be an easy way to do it.

Ken:

What interesting events did Ken Storch mention when he talked about police involvement with ufos?

Dennis Balthaser:

What he did, he had a white board, like a black board, a chalk board and he actually went through the Roswell incident. The who, what, where, when and why of the incident. It was kind of unique the way he did it. I had never seen Roswell presented that way. It was kind of neat the way he did it. He has gone public with this. He is a retired policemen. He was a thirty year policeman in Colorado. At the risk of being ridiculed, he is brave enough to go public and discuss police involvement in ufo sightings. He has been on a couple of tv shows, "The Unexplained" and Dan Akroyd's "Unplugged" on ufos. In fact I saw him the other night, on the History channel I believe, talking about the way he does his forensic testing. He used to be in the Air Force. He was in the Strategic Air Command during the war between Egypt and Israel and they had some stuff come across radar then that they didn't know about. That was back in the 1960s. It is a fascinating approach to doing the research and doing it using the forensic methods that the police departments use.

Ken:

What I find fascinating about it is the fact that a lot of policemen have seen things, but haven't come forward because of the ridicule factor.

Dennis Balthaser:

Some of our best witnesses Ken are policemen, airline pilots, people who demand respect really.

Ken:

I am well aware of that.

Dennis Balthaser:

Most of them don't say much. The O'Hare airport incident was a good example, where the airline ground crews and pilots saw this object hovering over the gate at United Airlines. What bothered me about that is that it is the second busiest airport in the United States and the government could care less that there is something hanging over the second busiest airport, when we are under terror threat everyday.

Ken:

Well, I think personally that the government knows that there is nothing that they can do about it and they really do care....

Dennis Balthaser:

Yeah, you got it.

Ken:

They put up a facade of not caring, because there is nothing that they can do and they don't want to panic the people.

Dennis Balthaser:

That is an excellent point and I am glad that you brought it up, because my theory on Roswell and this is strictly my theory, because I haven't heard many people say this, but whatever is recovered at Roswell or even Aztec for that matter, sixty years later I don't believe that they know what they have, how it operates, propulsion, guidance systems. They don't know what their motive was for being here, don't know where they are from and have no control over it.

Ken:

You know I sort of feel that way too.

Dennis Balthaser:

I think until they get the military advantage out of it, if they can get here they have technology that we can't even imagine, so the military will want that technology. Until they get that and are satisfied with it, they won't go public or admit that it ever happened.

Ken:

Well I think that they may have gotten some extraneous things out of it, such as the shape of certain things that fly...

Dennis Balthaser:

Oh the F-117 and the B-2 bomber definitely look like something from out of space when you look at them head on. It is the way they are designed and I think that you are right, that some of the technology has come from it. I don't agree with Lieutenant Colonel Corso's "The Day After Roswell". His book is good, but there are no references in the back to support it. I met him three times and liked him as a person, but you know that micro chips were developed at Texas Instruments and the guy that did it got the Nobel Peace Prize for it, so that don't hold water. He was never a member of the NSA, as he claimed to have been and we were working on night vision, the stuff we had captured from the Germans. We had used infrared and then we got this night vision, the green night vision. That way he presented it is impossible because it was so simple.

Ken:

Well, I always had a hunch that Kelly Johnson, I don't know if you know who Kelly Johnson is?

Dennis Balthaser:

Yeah, Skunk Works.

Ken:

Yeah. I always had a hunch that he knew something, that he was given some information....

Dennis Balthaser:

Yes I am sure.

Ken:

The SR-71 Blackbird, the materials didn't exist when they started building that plane. I always felt that they had to have gotten the idea for the plane from somewhere..

Dennis Balthaser:

Yeah. Kelly Johnson was brilliant, there was no doubt about that. I think that Oppenheimer was involved and that he knew some of this stuff. I think that several others that were involved knew a lot more than was ever released.

Ken:

I believe that too. Ted Phillips has been gathering evidence for years at ufo crash sites. What revelations did he make when he was talking at the symposium, if any?

Dennis Balthaser:

He is working a case in Missouri right now, physical evidence and he has over three thousand documented cases of physical evidence. By physical evidence I am talking about craft that come down and leave a physical trace on the ground. Some of these are circular in shape. Years later grass won't grown up through it. He does a lot of testing on the soil to find out what is there. There is one case, he won't tell us where it is at in Missouri, but he is working it extremely heavy. He and I didn't know this, began his investigations back in 1964 when he was a research associate to Doctor J. Allen Hynek. Hynek of course started the Center For UFO Studies in Chicago and I think that it was Hynek that told him to start doing this physical trace stuff because that is where the information would come from. He started specializing in that and he has invested some time. There are six hundred cases that I am aware of and in addition to that he has participated in the American Institute of Aeronautics and in aerospace and science meetings along with Hynek, Jacques Vallet and is a member of a select team that went to the United Nations with Hynek, Vallet and Gordon Cooper. He has been right in the forefront of this stuff. He's got two books out entitled "Physical Traces" associated with ufos and "Sighting & Delphos". He just started a dive team where they do underwater research now. He is actively working his Missouri case, one in Arkansas and I think one in Slovakia and the Ukraine.

Ken:

When airplanes land. little pieces fall off and they find bolts and they find washers, etc. Did he ever find anything that could be considered a piece of a ufo?

Dennis Balthaser:

No he didn't mention anything about any metal fragments of any kind. The main thing that he was into were the traces that are left when it sets down and what it does to the earth, to the dirt. That is basically where he concentrates, I think.

Ken:

I guess the ufos are much further ahead of us on that.

Dennis Balthaser:

I'm sure.

Ken:

Did Dr. Marcel reveal anything that we would consider new about his father, or anything about the Roswell crash?

Dennis Balthaser:

Have you read or seen his book?

Ken:

No, I know about it, but have not read it.

Dennis Balthaser:

"The Roswell Legacy", it is out of print right now, in fact they are going to add to it and republish it again, but for your audience, if they never buy another book about Roswell, I think that "The Roswell Legacy", by Jesse Marcel Jr. is worth having in their library. In the book he talks about some things that nobody had ever heard. He was quiet for some sixty years and never said anything. Now he decided to, his dad on his deathbed said tell the truth when you can. There is no doubt that his dad was the scapegoat for Roswell. He was the top intelligence officer in the world at the time.

Ken:

Yeah there is no doubt about that. (that he was the scapegoat for Roswell)

Dennis Balthaser:

The amazing thing about Jesse Marcell Jr., he is a helicopter pilot and a medical doctor, he was called back to active duty in the Iraq war in October 2004, shortly after his 68th birthday as a flight surgeon flying 225 hours of combat missions.

Ken:

Yeah, that I knew.

Dennis Balthaser:

He was discharged again in 2005 and he told me that he has close to 30 years military service. You talk about a credible witness, they don't come any better than Jesse. I'm working with him right now, trying to get my webmaster to do his website. He is not happy with the website he has. I think that my webmaster is going to work with him and work up a new website for him. Some of the stuff in that book is mind boggling and what I like about Jesse is that when he was asked questions at Aztec, if he didn't know about it, he said so, he didn't make any up. His knowledge is what he knew from his dad. He handled the material from the Roswell incident in the kitchen the night that dad came back from the debris field and talked about the beams with the writing on it and the different metal and the materials that were there.

Ken:

And his father gave him a piece to keep, yeah.

Dennis Balthaser:

Well he never admitted that. He was asked that, but he never would admit to it. He was eleven years old at the time. He said he didn't know why my dad was waking me up at one o'clock in the morning to see a bunch of garbage metal. Then he said that after that, he helped dad put it back in the box and went to bed and then they didn't see it there after a couple of days and that is when they flew Marcel to Fort Worth, to General Ramey's office. When his dad came back, he told his mother and him that was a non event the other night and you didn't see anything. Jesse is just super, I've got the utmost respect for him.

Ken:

I thought that it was kind of unusual that there were some former state officials in attendance. Did any of them have anything interesting to say?

Dennis Balthaser:

No, but we had one guy there that really bothered me. He was a rabbi at the Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs. A big old boy and during the whole Aztec Symposium, he was staying at the same hotel that the speakers were staying and we come down after everything at night and visit with each other and he would pop questions to us and I really didn't know where he was coming from. At one of the lectures, I don't remember which one, he asked a question which was really bizarre. He kept arguing about it that there was nothing to this and I finally went up to him on break and said that you need to go back to the Air Force Academy and do some research and them come to another symposium with some better questions. He wasn't too happy with me. We were really getting tired of him because he was getting personal, like with Stanton (Freedman) he was asking him about his religious beliefs and stuff like that, which is not something that Stanton (Freedman) is normally going to talk about.

Ken:

Of course not.

Dennis Balthaser:

Being a rabbi at the Air Force Academy ran a flag up for me and I kept an eye out on him, but I could just never figure out his motive.

Ken:

Ah maybe he was just somebody with a big mouth.

Dennis Balthaser:

Could be. He may have been harassing us, seeing how far he could go, I don't know.

Ken:

If I was to go out to the Aztec crash site, what would I see?

Dennis Balthaser:

Well it's a dirt road to get out there and like I said, it is in the petroleum fields and once you are there you walk a little distance and then you see a spot where trees have been knocked down, it is kind of a bare spot. You would walk on the road that wasn't there prior to 1948 and you would see this concrete slab. It is my understanding that the craft had trouble and was trying to make a turn and miss a kind of cliff, that sits up on top of an aurora or mesa. Apparently it was trying to miss coming into the wall of that cliff and came down pretty much intact. Inside the craft they claim that they had found two humanoids about two feet in height, slumped over an instrument panel and they were charred deep brown, which means that there was a fire inside it. Another twelve bodies remained sprawled on the floor. The instrument panel had several buttons and levers with hieroglyphic type symbols as well as symbols illumined on a small display screen.....

Ken:

Would I see anything today? In other words if I went out there would there be an area where maybe nothing is growing?

Dennis Balthaser:

You would see a bare spot, an area where the trees have been knocked down

Ken:

No plants are growing there or anything?

Dennis Balthaser:

No, I believe that there are plants growing there now, 60 years later. It is kind of like Roswell, if you go out to the Roswell site, you are not going to see anything. You can go ten miles out of Roswell and see the same thing. Sixty years of climate change, rain and wind, it has pretty much taken care of itself.

Ken:

Did you speak yourself at the symposium or were you just the mc

Dennis Balthaser:

Oh I was just mc this year and I find that this is harder work than being a lecturer, because the preparation. You have to do all the research on all the speakers and that takes quite a while to do the research, the background and stuff. I try to get personal with them, whether they are married, where they live, their education background, to give the audience some history on them. The way I do things, I guess it is my engineering background, is that I work up an introduction and then I send it to them for approval, so that there is no surprises when I do the introduction.

Ken:

Yeah that is a good way to do it.

Dennis Balthaser:

They all enjoyed that, a couple of them made a few small changes in the wording and things like that. Actually running it and keeping things on schedule and things like that is real time consuming and we had busy days from eight o'clock in the morning to nine or ten o'clock at night.

Ken:

I bet.

Dennis Balthaser:

As a speaker you do your thing for an hour and ten minutes and then you sit at your table and you relax. It's different and I enjoy doing it, I guess that I am part ham

Ken:

What did Duane Tidahl, a tv producer have to contribute?

Dennis Balthaser:

Many of us that were researchers there at Aztec, had experience with less than satisfactory results when interviewed by tv documentary people over the years and we empathized this to him. His background included producing, writing and editing the UFO Files series on the History Channel. That included UFO Hunters, Hanger 18, which is still being shown, Texas Roswell, When UFOs Arrive, Alien Encounters and several others. He teamed up with John Greenewald Jr. who has got the Black Vault website and has done some work with him and has started his own production company in California and he interviewed most of us while he was in Aztec for an upcoming documentary that he is doing. He emphasized how films are made, what is involved and many times why they come out like they come out. He is trying to change that as an individual producer. Good presentation

Ken:

In your opinion what was the most interesting discussion?

Dennis Balthaser:

Ted Phillips was good and Timothy Good. Timothy had just a tremendous amount of slides that he showed of different aircraft, different ufos that have been spotted around the world. He has spent a lot of time in Puerto Rico and has done a lot of research down there. He talked about the British records that are supposedly opened and not all have been like ours. It was just a real interesting presentation. I don't know if I could really pick out one, like I said in the beginning we had probably the best line up of speakers we have had at Aztec in eleven years. Just good solid researchers with factual information for the audience and then let them decide what they want to believe.

Ken:

That is what I wanted to ask you. If I were to compare the very first symposium at Aztec with the symposium that you just had, what would be the major differences?

Dennis Balthaser:

The caliber of the speakers, the organization of the symposium itself. The first year that they had it, it was at the old library itself and they used other buildings and people had to go from building to building to find speakers and very little crowds. It was just a minimum amount of people that were there. They have just improved it so much over the years and organized it better. One of the things that I need your audience to know is that if they go to the website www.Aztecufo.com, they are raffling off, to make money for the library, they are raffling off a 2008 Chevrolet Eldorado extended cab pickup truck. Tickets are $50 and they are only selling one thousand tickets. If you want a new pickup truck, here is a way to get one for $50 and if you don't want the pickup, they will give you $20,000 cash.

Ken:

That's not bad.

Dennis Balthaser:

You have a one in one thousand chance, really it's a good deal and benefits the library quite a bit.

Ken:

Have I missed anything important that you feel that people would like to know about?

Dennis Balthaser:

Yeah, I think that Scott and Susan Ramsey, they do the Aztec research and he has been doing it for years. They met through a raffle at an Aztec Symposium. Susan was a radio show host in Farmington in the four corners area. Scott was single at the time and so was she and they thought that they would just have a raffle for a lunch with Scott Ramsey, who was one of the speakers. They did that this year, they had a raffle for all the speakers including me the mc to have a lunch with us. That is kind of neat and the girl that got me had spent, I think twenty dollars on tickets or something like that. She got to have lunch with me and you get to talk one on one with somebody that way and it is kind of neat. Susan won the raffle for Scott Ramsey, a couple of years ago and that developed into a friendship and then they got married. Susan moved to North Carolina, where Scott lived and they both live over there now. They were both heavily involved in the symposium for all eleven years. She having been a radio show host, has interviewed many of the people. Scott has traveled to thirty one states and has interviewed nearly seventy three first and second hand witnesses and has achieved over three thousand, Atomic Energy Commission, Air Force, FBI and CIA documents. He's also located three radar stations in the area that we didn't even know existed and there again that could have some effect on the craft coming down if it was microwave radio, which it was. They are doing some excellent research on Aztec and I think they are going to come out with a book, probably this year, on his research into the Aztec situation and I think it is going to be an interesting book.

Ken:

Yeah it sounds good. Well maybe I can make it next year.

Dennis Balthaser:

I hope so.

Ken:

Dennis, I want to thank you very much, it was very informative, I am sure that everybody is going to enjoy reading about this.

Dennis Balthaser:

Good, let's do it again.

Ken:

Sure.

Dennis Balthaser:

Have a nice day.